Monday, November 29, 2010

BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT Update: MORE Videos Released on YouTube..................... Plus Online Book: A HISTORY OF THE SIX RIVERS NATIONAL FOREST, Feisty JREFs

BIGFOOT'S BLOG, Another Special Notice, Late-November 2010

Here are SOME MORE!
Videos Four through Eight of our
BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT 
have now been posted.

Our summer's studies' results are finally coming forth. "C.I.," Robert Leiterman and Yours Truly set out to know Bluff Creek and its history better, especially as pertains to the Patterson-Gimlin Film. We sought to find the true site and track-way location, despite the fact that there are at least five different proposals from various researchers, and memories seem to have grown vague and as mysterious as the regrown forest now covering the once open sandbar where the famous Bigfoot film was shot. Here are the three introductory Bigfoot-nerd sessions trying to lay the preliminary foundations for our subsequent visits to the site area. Enjoy!
Earth Explorer Image centered on the general consensus PGF site area.
As Robert puts it on the YouTube pages: "Steven Streufert, Ian and Robert Leiterman are taking another look at the P-G Film site 43 years later. With conflicting thoughts as to exactly where the film site is today, they have decided to re-evaluate the facts, interview those in the know and spend some extensive leg work on the ground. They are trying to piece together what nature has spent the last 43 years turning back into a riparian forest. Part of an on going series."
Just a picture... links follow below.
Have you seen the first three??? WATCH PARTS ONE THROUGH THREE HERE ON BIGFOOT'S BLOG. Click the link now or forever regret it. CLICK PLAYER BOXES BELOW TO VIEW YouTube WITHIN THIS PAGE.

Here is PART FOUR of the BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT. Watch Robert Leiterman as he walks up the creek from the Bluff Creek Bridge to the Patterson-Gimlin Film site.

Here is PART FIVE of the BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT, wherein we hike down the dirt road above the site and observe the sand bar and creek canyon below, and finally reach the bat boxes landing on the creek.

Here is PART SIX of our BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT, wherein three Bigfooting nerds really geek out in the rain nitpicking over the details given us by Peter Byrne for his location of the Patterson-Gimlin Film site.

Here is PART SEVEN of our BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT on BFRO-VIDEOS on YouTube. Here at the "Peter Byrne Site" we compare old photos to new landscapes, stumble upon stumps, and dig in the sand searching for the very ground Patty walked upon in the PGF.

Here is PART EIGHT of our BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT on BFRO-VIDEOS on YouTube. Here we bumble and wade up the creek, through the maze of fallen trees and wood debris, and come to the ostensible site as identified by Christopher Murphy in his book KNOW THE SASQUATCH/BIGFOOT. Still no conclusive proof of the PGF location.

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Go to bfro.net for more BF info.

If the above embedded video boxes don't pop up do check for them at BFRO-VIDEOS on YouTube. Look in "Uploads" and then "See All." There's a lot of other cool stuff in there.
Or just click one of these links:

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We've been a little active on the JREF Forum lately. Click the name to view the thread about where we got started... or HERE, and HERE (these are pages 116-118 of the "Bigfoot: The Patterson Gimlin Film - Part 3" thread)... and you will see why we had to dive into it. Perhaps we'll always have to deal with this "Swastika Steve" business now. Oh well. Perhaps that is better than "BipolarBookBoy" or "Charlie Manson Eyes"!

History of Six Rivers National Forest book cover
You know what they say: If you can't beat them on the subject itself, attack the messenger. It is fun talking with skeptics! After all, we are one, too, in many ways; but we choose to leave Bigfoot out of that skepticism, and focus more on concepts of Bigfoot to be skeptical over. In fact, we are SKEPTICAL OF SKEPTICS. So there.

Anyway, thanks to one AlaskaBushPilot we got a tip on this fine book. It is available free online, so check it out. It is a US Government Printing Office/US Forest Service book,

A HISTORY OF THE SIX RIVERS NATIONAL FOREST... Commemorating the First 50 Years.
By Pamela A. Conners, Historian, Six Rivers National Forest.

This puts Bluff Creek and it's Bigfooting history into perspective. Check it out!
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Here are two recent photos from Willow Creek just for you. They were taken with an iPhone, not the greatest camera. Click to Enlarge....
So much for Bigfoot hunting in Bluff Creek for the year!
The G-O Road, near Bluff Creek and the "Bigfoot Lives" sign.
Reported Bigfoot track found at Big Rock, Willow Creek.
After Bobo and Richard drove all the way out from
Arcata we found out that it was a bear track!
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ANGRY BIGFOOT SPEAKS!
Hu-man! You get call say Bigfoot track on sand at Big Rock. You drive stinky truck all way from Arcata and look. You think you find bear track. Fool hu-man, me leave that track by go tip-toe. Me sure fool you! Ha ha. Me still LMAOROTFLOL, you so puny and have no fur.
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This blog is copyright and all that jazz, save for occasional small elements borrowed for "research" and information or satirical purposes only, 2010, Bigfoot Books and Steven Streufert. Borrowings for non-commercial purposes will be tolerated without the revenge of Angry Bigfoot, if notification, credit, citation and a kindly web-link are given, preferably after contacting us and saying, Hello, like a normal person would before taking a cup of salt. No serious rip-offs of our material for vulgar commercial gain will be tolerated without major BF stomping action coming down on you, hu-man.

Tuesday, November 23, 2010

NEWS FLASH! BLUFF CREEK FILM SITE PROJECT, First Three Videos Released on BFRO-VIDEOS YouTube Page

BIGFOOT'S BLOG, Special Notice, November 2010

The results of our summer's studies are finally coming forth. "C.I.," Robert Leiterman and Yours Truly set out to know Bluff Creek and its history better, especially as pertains to the Patterson-Gimlin Film. We sought to find the true site and track-way location, despite the fact that there are at least five different proposals from various researchers, and memories seem to have grown vague and as mysterious as the regrown forest now covering the once open sandbar where the famous Bigfoot film was shot. Here are the three introductory Bigfoot-nerd sessions trying to lay the preliminary foundations for our subsequent visits to the site area. Enjoy!

CLICK PLAYER BOXES BELOW TO VIEW YouTube WITHIN THIS PAGE.







Coming Up Soon!!! Robert Leiterman hikes up Bluff Creek from the Bluff Creek Bridge to the PGF site area, filming all the way. Also in the hopper: a very rainy day finds the three intrepid investigators out in the downpour trying to find those Big Trees, comparing the Peter Byrne, MK Davis and Barackman-Gimlin identified sites, trying to find "Dahinden's X" and Daniel Perez' arrow, and generally coming quite close to death by hypothermia and uphill mud climbing exhaustion. ALSO: An extensive new blog entry on our DAY ONE is in the tank and nearly ready to bottle. It should be up this week.

If the above embedded video boxes don't pop up do check for them at BFRO-VIDEOS on YouTube.
Or find them here: PART ONE, PART TWO, and PART THREE.

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ANGRY BIGFOOT SPEAKS!!!

Ha ha, hu-man! You spend all summer film at Bluff Creek, you STILL NOT film Me!

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All video shot and edited by Robert Leiterman. Copyrighted by him, with content from Steven Streufert and Ian (C.I.), 2010. Film site images photographed on computer screens, from books, or on-site, as seen in the videos are used for research purposes only, and are seen being used as such. This blog is copyrighted too, though you may borrow and quote if full citation is given, preferably with notice to us and a kindly link to this blog.

Friday, November 12, 2010

Brief Conversations Regarding Bluff Creek and the P-G Film Site, with JOHN GREEN and PETER BYRNE; More Talk with CLIFF BARACKMAN, SEAN FRIES and DANIEL PEREZ. Preliminary Summary of Site Location Theories

BIGFOOT'S BLOG, EARLY-MID NOVEMBER 2010 EDITION
(From the Vaults of Our Vast Blog/Research Backlog, Here Comes Another One)
The PGF site and track-way location often seem like a moving needle in a very
large haystack. (Paraphrased from a statement Sean Fries made about Bigfoot.)
If you can hide a film site in here, you can surely hide a Bigfoot!
This is 
Part Two in our Preliminary Information Series
 for the upcoming blogs on our recent 
BLUFF CREEK FILM PROJECT. 
Hello All! Here is some more highly enjoyable fodder for your Bigfoot Nerdiness. This blog entry is a collection of background research and inquiries we made in regard to the location of the Patterson-Gimlin Bigfoot film site, and the history of Bluff Creek. Little did we know that this issue would generate controversy and politics; but lo! it is already coming our way. Please also see the preliminary information entry, part one, our INFORMAL INTERVIEW WITH JIM McCLARIN. Soon all will be revealed when Robert Leiterman gets through with the massive job of editing over six hours of raw video. These will be presented on BFRO-VIDEOS, the BFRO YouTube page.... soon, we promise, soon! Robert is calling these The Bluff Creek Film Project: A Journey of Rediscovery. What will follow in future blogs and these videos is US trying to discover the real site, prove it if we can, and perhaps to rule out the false ones among at least FIVE variant proposed film site locations. It ain't easy, as we weren't there in those early days; and many who were either can't seem to exactly recall, or present varying views, or have noticed upon returning to the area that it has changed beyond recognition. Crucial early witnesses such as Bob Titmus and Rene Dahinden are sadly no longer with us. We, ourselves, have been to the PGF site about 10 times now, as part of many more general Bluff Creek trips, and feel it is time to express our provisional views and opinions. Just consider what follows from that perspective, and consider the evidence we present. If you have contrary views, do feel free to contact us.
Bob Gimlin on the Bluff Creek "road," or, dirt and gravel trail. On the path
of Bigfooting destiny. Filmed by Roger Patterson.
Since we talked a lot with Mr. McClarin about the Bluff Creek creekside "road," really a logging plow, a cat trail, and then a Jeep path, here for your viewing pleasure is a decent image of BOB GIMLIN riding on that road. It is taken from the very same reel that later bears the PGF Bigfoot segment, and in fact, comes right before it on the reel (as seen in John Green's copy of the film, as shown on the BBC X-Creatures documentary), and was shot that same day, October 20th, 1967.
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A gaze seemingly from another world.
How, you might ask, can a location as famous as this become "lost"? This is the Bigfooting equivalent of losing track of where JFK was shot or, in personal terms, losing track of the house where one lived as a child. In regard to research seeking to prove whether Bigfoot really does exist as a species, this location may not be so significant--and many indeed have questioned our obsession with this site and area. What does it really matter? To us, though, it does matter--on a primary level simply because we want to feel the magic of the place; but more pervasively it is an important part of verifying the background and context of this famous film. Though many consider the PGF to be a hoax, the fact remains that it is the most compelling and undeniably vivid pieces to the Sasquatch puzzle. It has yet to be replicated, and cannot seemingly be disproved. If this is not a film of a man in a suit, then what IS it? Clearly, it is the moving image of a living creature, one not yet verified by our presumptuous and conservative Science. Therefore, anything, any little piece we may know about this film and its production, and the PLACE where it was taken, is of incredible import to the world of wildlife biology and hominology. We urge you, therefore, to read on....
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The following conversations were conducted mainly via email, though in some cases are based upon personal conversations as well.

Green in the A-and-E Bigfoot: Ancient Mysteries documentary.
Photo taken from VHS on TV, by Steven Streufert.
A BRIEF TALK WITH JOHN GREEN

We consider John Green to be the "Moses of Bigfooting." His early books clearly did more to advance the subject than anything short of the PGF itself. He did this with logic and wit, taking the subject seriously rather than sensationalizing it. If it weren't for his involvement in the field and during Onion/Blue Creek Mountain track-way finds, and his contact with Roger Patterson, there most certainly would never have been a PGF. He was one of the first researchers on the scene documenting the film site, though ultimately fellow Candian, Rene Dahinden, was the one to document it most thoroughly over time. From what we can tell, John was on the film site with Jim McClarin in 1968, then sometime around 1998 to 2000 with Bob Titmus, and finally went there in 2003 with the attendees and speakers of the International Bigfoot Symposium. Sometime before the last date the site had changed so much that Green could no longer recognize it with surety. Rather than trying to be a big shot about it, he admits this, and we find that honorable and true to his character and integrity. Green was also an original member of the Pacific Northwest Expedition into Bluff Creek in 1959.

BIGFOOT BOOKS (OUR LETTER):
"Hello again John,
Might I ask you a few brief questions? A few associates and I are going back yet again this coming weekend to Bluff Creek, our goal being to record and document a trip from Louse Camp to where we all think the PG film was filmed.

Could you tell me:
* when you were last there did you feel certain that you were on the right spot?
* if so, what signs did you see that would confirm it?
* was it upstream from the flat at the bat boxes? Or downstream, as MK Davis thinks it is?
* how far up? At the big gulch with the logjam and rootballs, or perhaps a bit farther? If down, how far?
* did you find the "big tree"?
* how far from the current creek position is it, and how much is left of it in a level state as seen in the old days?

If I send you a close-up topo map could you put your X on it? I've already asked this question of Perez, Barackman, and a traveling companion of MK, as well as many of the California BFRO guys. Al Hodgson feels that the site visited in 2003 is incorrect. I feel that your perspective on these matters would be invaluable,  especially as a new generation is moving in, and there are some wildly divergent opinions. Your reply before Friday would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

Best regards, Steve, Bigfoot Books, Willow Creek"

JOHN GREEN:
"I am not certain that I was at the right spot, because I could not find the big tree. Otherwise I would have been sure, as I could only find one place where the level area in the bottom of the valley seemed sufficiently wide. If that is the right place then the creek has changed course from the one side to the other and  eroded the entire site of the action away. Keep in mind that I was just there once, in 1968, and did not try to find it again for about 30 years."

BF BOOKS: Hi again John,
This kind of thing makes me worry we will never again be sure of the place. I mean, the exact location of the film trackway.

I wonder, do you have any other photos of the film site, aside from the more common ones that one sees on the internet? What one normally sees is the thing with Jim McClarin in it. Any others, especially those documenting the trees and surroundings, would be absolutely helpful to us. We'll be up there on the 18th of this month.

I've been asking around, though you are the one I'd trust the most without Rene around anymore. I sent a similar email to Peter Byrne, but I'm not too sure of his opinion after reading the Todd Neiss account where they quickly found the film site in only 15 minutes, and supposedly found the "big tree" that no one else has yet to locate with utter confidence.

After talking to Daniel Perez about this at length, I'm not too sure that his "X" on the map really corresponds with his location of the place on the ground. Do you recall, when you were there with him in 2003, did he actually settle on a single spot? And was that upstream from the "big gulch" where the creek splits into two streams at the logjam area? His "X" on the map is upstream from that area.

Green on Blue Creek Mountain, 1967
Any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated; and we would give you all the credit you deserve for it. I'll be writing about the trip on my blog, and Robert Leiterman is going to film it for presentation on the BFRO videos page on YouTube.

Thanks, and best regards, Steve, Bigfoot Books, Willow Creek

JOHN GREEN: "I have nothing further to contribute, and haven't even much recollection of the area as it was in 2003 {?}. I don't recall much about the location Dan picked out, except that it was in a wide area but there was no sign of the big tree there. If the tree had been logged there should be a stump, and if it fell down it should still be there and there should be a large hole, but nothing of either sort was found. Rene and Bob Titmus both knew how the site had been transformed through their repeated visits, but when I was down there with Bob about 10 years ago he was not able to hike in. He told us to walk the old road across the west hillside and we would be able to look down on the site, but we never saw anything recognizable and when we went down and walked back and forth along the creek we only found the one area where the level bottom of the valley was wide enough. In 1967 the creek was close to the east (?] side of the level area, but in the intervening years it had eroded its way close to the west side, so it must have washed away the actual site.

Jim McClarin or Al Hodgson might be able to help. [ED. NOTE: Excision of one sentence for reasons of privacy.] I still think the only reliable test is if someone can locate a place wide enough for what the film shows and with a big tree close by on the hillside. "
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Byrne in the A-and-E Bigfoot: Ancient Mysteries docu-
mentary. Photo from VHS on TV, by Steven Streufert.
A BRIEF CONVERSATION WITH PETER BYRNE


Peter Byrne first found a Yeti track in 1948, so he has been at this business for quiet a long time. He was involved in the Tom Slick-financed Abominable Snowman hunts of the mid-late fifties, eventually being brought over by Slick to take over the Pacific Northwest Expedition here in our Bluff Creek area. He has been one of Bigfooting's most public and recognizable figures, always presenting a striking and somewhat heroic image in his fedora, ascot tie and safari suits. He is known to have been at the PGF site in 1972, and then off and on over the years as he retired from and then re-entered the field. Even at his advanced age now, he visited the film site again just this year.

(This is fundamentally the same letter sent to Green. Below find Mr. Byrne's responses in CAPITALS.)

Hello again Peter,
Might I ask you a brief few questions? A few associates and I are going back yet again this coming weekend to Bluff Creek, our goal being to record and document a trip from Louse Camp to where we all think the PG film was filmed.

Could you tell me:
* when you were last there did you feel certain that you were on the right spot? Todd Neiss says so in his account.
* if so, what signs did you see that would confirm it? Are there photos?

PETER BYRNE: LAST THERE? LAST WEEK.
AND, SIGNS ... THE TREE GROUPINGS, ESPECIALLY ONE TREE THAT APPEARS IN THE FOOOTAGE, VERY LARGE AND OLD NOW (100 YEARS).
THERE ARE LOTS OF PHOTOS OF THIS PARTICUAR GROUP OF THREE TREES. ONE OF THE BEST IS FRAME 352 OF THE FOOTAGE.

* was it upstream from the car park flat at the bat boxes? Or downstream, as MK Davis thinks it is?

PETER BYRNE: NO. MK IS WRONG. THERE ARE TWO BAT BOXES, NOW BOTH DOWN. (VANDALS) FROM THE NORTHERN MOST OF THE TWO BOXES ONE CAN DRAW A LINE DUE (NOTE, MAGNETIC) NORTH DIRECT (ACROSS THE STERAM) TO THE LARGEST OF THE TREES. DISTANCE? ABT 100 YARDS.

* how far up? At the big gulch with the logjam and rootballs, or perhaps a bit farther? If down, how far?
* did you find the "big tree"?

PETER BYRNE: THE SAND BAR ON WHICH THE 67 FOOTAGE SUBJECT WALKS IS GONE NOW AND HAS BEEN REPLACED BY THE STREAM ITSELF. SO WHERE THE STREAM IS NOW, THAT IS WHERE THE SAND BAR WAS. THE SAND BAR YOU WILL RECALL EDGED THE HILL, IN THIS CASE THE HILL THAT RISES ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE STREAM. BUT NOTE, IN ELIMINATING THE SAND BAR (WASHING IT AWAY WITH FLOODING ETC) THE STREAM HAS NOW DUG ITSELF A 20 FOOT DEEP BED. SO THE ORIGINAL LEVEL OF THE SAND BAR, WERE IT THERE NOW, WOULD BE 20 FEET ABOVE THE WATER OF THE STREAM OR, NOW, THE SAME LEVEL ON WHICH THE BAT BOXES LIE. AGAIN, NOTE, THIS MEANS THAT THE BIG TREE AND ITS COMPANION GROUP (OF TWO) WHICH ORIGINALLY APPEARED IN THE FOOTAGE AS GROWING OUT OF THE SURFACE OF THE SAND BAR, NOW HAVE ROOT SYSTEMS 20 FEET HIGHER THAN PREVIOUSLY. ALSO FOR YOUR INTEREST SOME OF THE STUMPS (TWO ANYWAY) WHICH APPEAR IN FAME 352 ARE STILL THERE (AS OF LAST WEEK).

* how far from the current creek position is it, and how much is left of it in a level state as seen in the old days?

PETER BYRNE: IS WHAT? THE TREE? SEE ABOVE.

Also, how did you access the site in the old days?

PETER BYRNE: NEVER DID. THERE WAS NO "SITE" IN MY DAYS THERE ... 1960 THROUGH 1962, YEARS BEFORE THE FILMING. I HAVE BEEN TO THE SITE SINCE THEN MANY TIMES, FOR RESEARCH, PHOTOGRAPHY, MEASUREMENTS USING AMONG OTHER THINGS AL HODGSON'S SON RICK AS A MODEL.

If I send you a close-up topo map could you put your X on it?

PETER BYRNE: I'LL TRY. BUT ITS NOT HARD TO FIND THE SITE. ROAD 12N10H (VIA 12N10 FROM ORLEANS) [Ed. Note: Actually, it's 12N13, and 12N13H, off "Eyesee Road," the G-O Road, from Orleans.] GOES RIGHT TO IT...AND IS 4 x 4 DRIVEABLE. THE OTHER WAY IS TO GO TO LOUSE CAMP (WHICH I AM SURE YOU CAN FIND) AND WALK UP THE STREAM UNTIL YOU COME TO A LARGE (40 FEET + HIGH) ROCK OUTCROP ON THE EAST SIDE OF THE GORGE. THE SITE IS ABOUT 350 YARDS BEYOND THAT.

I've already asked this question of Perez, Barackman, and a traveling companion of MK, as well as many of the California BFRO guys. Al Hodgson feels that the site visited in 2003 is incorrect. Many area locals around here all seem to offer different locations, too. I fear that the site may soon be "lost" to posterity if we do not act. I feel that your perspective on these matters would be invaluable, especially as a new generation is moving in, and there are some wildly divergent opinions. Your reply before Friday would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

The famous Peter Byrne Photo, Al Hodgson's Print, 
given to him by Peter Byrne as a gift (it features Al's son);
photographed at Al's home, 2010, by Steven Streufert.
PETER BYRNE: I'LL ATTACH A PHOTO OF THE SITE WHICH I THINK (TOO SMALL TO SEE IT IN MY FILE) IS FROM ONE OF MY VISITS IN 1972, WHEN THE SITE WAS STILL INTACT OTHER THAN LOSING THE BIRCH TREES [Ed.: Alders and Maples, actually] SEEN IN 352.

BIGFOOT BOOKS: Peter, I'm thinking about this more, and wonder:

Your location of the site across from the bat boxes implies that if you are standing at the parking area there looking north, right by the fire ring and all, the creek would probably have been flowing where you parked your truck, more or less, in order for there to be sufficient space for the sandbar and the dimensions of the film. Is that correct?

PETER BYRNE: THE ANSWER TO THIS LIES IN THE WIDTH OF THE ORIGINAL SANDBAR. THIS MAY HAVE BEEN RECORDED SOMEWHERE; I DO NOT KNOW WHAT IT IS. OR WAS. SO... TO TRY AND DETERMINE WHERE THE CREEK WAS IN OCTOBER 1967 JUST TAKE THAT MEASUREMENT, WHATEVER IT IS, AND MEASURE OUT FROM THE BASE OF THE HILL. THAT WILL GIVE YOU THE SANDBAR'S ORIGINAL LOCALTION.

The "big bend" of which Gimlin speaks would have been downstream from the camping area, and the retreat of Patty (after Titmus) would have been near that tiny creek that flows into that "big gulch" there today, which is where Murphy locates the site. Right?

PETER BYRNE: YES BECAUSE GENERALLY SPEAKING THE OLD COURSE OF THE STREAM HAS NOT CHANGED; THE BENDS, UP AND DOWN, NORTH AND SOUTH, ARE STILL THE SAME AS IN 1967.

I'm wondering if 20 feet of erosion is possible, too. Down in the gulch there seems to be some six feet of descent of the creek from the old sand on the bar, which is easily recoverable by digging one's hand down at the roots of the alder trees in there.

PETER BYRNE: LET ME ASK MY COMPANIONS OF LAST WEEK WHAT THEY THINK THE NEW DEPTH OF THE CREEK IS. I DID NOT MEASRE IT. IT MAY HAVE BEEN A BIT LESS THAN MY ROUGH EYE MEASUREMENT OF 20 FEET.

Anyway, we will definitely be checking your location. Any further tips would be of great help, especially a recent photo of the big trees.

PETER BYRNE: THE BIG TREES ARE NOW HEAVILY OBSCURED BY BRUSH AND HARD TO PHOTOGRAPH AT THIS TIME. HOWEVER, THE SINGLE BIG TREE (SEE FRAME 352) IS DISTINGUISED BY FOUR THINGS. ONE, ITS OBVIOUS AGE. TWO, ITS GREAT SIZE. THREE, ITS BARK WHICH IS HEAVILY INDENTED BY WOODPECKER HOLES. AND FOUR, ITS COMPANION TREES, AS SEEN IN THE 67 FOOTAGE AND AS SEEN IN MY PHOTOGRAPHS TAKEN IN 1972 (I'LL TRY AND FIND ONE AND ATTACH IT HERE). ALSO, AS OF NOW, ITS POSITIVE DIRECTION FROM THE UPPERMOST (THE NORTHERN MOST) OF THE FALLEN BAT BOXES WHICH IS CLOSE TO (MAYBE FOUR DEGREES LESS) MAGNETIC NORTH. USE A GOOD COMPASS, STAND CLOSE TO THE EAST BANK OF THE STREAM WITH YOUR BACK TO THE UPPERMOST (NORTHERN MOST) OF THE FALLEN BAT BOXES AND TAKE A BEARING; YOU SHOULD HAVE NO TROUBLE FINDING IT.

The old map from Byrne's book,
strangely out of correspondence
with any known landscape features.
Or, was Peter keeping the location 
secret? And where is/was that bridge?
Click to Enlarge.
I asked these same questions of John Green, but he could not say at all for sure, and did not get a clear sense of where the site was when they were all there with Bob after the 2003 symposium in Willow Creek. Bob was not positive either. Daniel seemed to know, but where he was differs from the mark on the map of Dahinden. None could identify the big tree. Hence, you seem to be the only one with a positive identification, save for newcomers who were not there in the days you guys were.

PETER BYRNE: GOOD LUCK. LET ME KNOW HOW YOU DO, PB.

PS/ CANNOT IMMEDIATELY FIND THE PIX I WANT TO SEND YOU. WILL SEARCH LATER TODAY AND SEND. IT IS ONE FROM '72 THAT HAS ALL THREE TREEES IN IT.
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PETER BYRNE: THIS PIC (1972) SHOWS THE BIG TREE PROBABLY BEST. NOTE ITS COMPANION TREES, STILL STANDING TODAY.

STEVEN ONE LAST NOTE...
IN MY NOTES TO YOU ... MY ESTIMATION OF THE DEPTH OF THE STREAM (ITS CHANNEL DEPTH, NOT ITS WATER DEPTH) FROM THE LEVEL OF WHAT USED TO BE THE SURFACE OF THE SAND BAR, IS VISUAL ONLY; WE DID NOT MEASURE IT. NOW MY ASSOCIATES IN CONSULTATION TELL ME THAT IT IS PROBABLY LESS THAN 20 FEET; MORE LIKE 10 OR 12 FEET. OVER TO YOU.  PB
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OUR SUMMARY OF P-G FILM SITE LOCATION THEORIES:
The Heart of Bluff Creek, and Lonesome Ridge
Here are two maps of the upper Bluff Creek basin, the confines of which are known to be the area where the famous PGF was shot in 1967. However, there is much dispute as to the EXACT location. The first map is a wide view, just up from Louse Camp. The second map, not to wholly bias the answers, shows the more precise area where most believe the location is.
PGF General Consensus Site Area, Detail, MK to Barackman
In studying this so far we have found the following.
* MK Davis feels the site is 500 yards or so downstream from the "bat boxes" at the landing below the dirt road seen in map 2.
* Peter Byrne says it is is right across the creek from the nearest bat box at the bottom of the road.
* Christopher Murphy thinks the site is right at the bottom of the "big gulch" bend seen in Map 2, just east of the little creek.
* Daniel Perez was seen identifying the site and investigating just up from Murphy's location.
* Perez' BIGFOOT AT BLUFF CREEK places the site, according to Dahinden, upstream just a bit, on the second segment of sand bar, just below the "bowling alley" (where the creek juts directly north).
* Cliff Barackman (and ourselves, sometimes) believe the last choice to be correct. Associates and I are currently investigating this and documenting topography, dimensions, extant background trees, etc.
* Others, such as some locals like Al Hodgson, think it was shot WAY downstream, more towards Louse Camp. None seem to agree on this locally.
* A few speculate that it was shot up at the top of the "bowling alley," or perhaps even so far upstream and to the east as Scorpion Creek (off the maps provided here).

Weigh in: take the images and in your favorite image processing program put an "X" or arrow to the spot you favor. Any supporting reasons or evidence, text or photos, as to why you believe such would be greatly helpful to all. Note: the "bat boxes" are just to the other side of the small creek entering the gulch, past to the west where the road is shown ending on the map above. The road actually goes down past that little creek a few dozen yards, as drawn in below.
As a Preview to Upcoming Blog Entries, Here is a Sketch of
Our Preliminary Findings of the Various Site Location Theories,
with a few common landmarks. Do CLICK TO ENLARGE VIEW.
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TALKING WITH SEAN FRIES
Sean with Cliff Barackman, 2007 PGF 40th Anni-
versay Celebration. Photo by Steven Streufert.
We talked with SEAN FRIES, Bigfoot researcher from Weaverville, CA, and he told us the location of the "M.K. Davis" Film Site, with which he agreed. Sean has spent many, many days in the area around Bluff Creek and in the mountains of Trinity County around his hometown. He has maintained a somewhat independent status as a researcher, though he was for a time affiliated with NABS. He told us that he has basically retired from the field of late, after having had a close-up face to face sighting of the Creature in Question. It looked more Neanderthalian than ape-like, he told us. Sean's writing may be found as included in Who's Watching You, by Linda Coil Suchy.

Sean had been there with M.K. Davis on a hike all the way up Bluff Creek a few years earlier. The came to this spot downstream from the area most feel is the PGF site and felt it to be right, going against the general consensus of most other researchers. It is, according to Sean, 500 yards downstream from the bat boxes camp site landing, at the bottom of 12N13H. (This site has been located and confirmed by us--see our future blog entries, and in map, above.) We had this little exchange, among many others, with Sean....

SEAN FRIES: I still haven't placed it yet [the commemorative bronze plaque to be placed on the spot M.K. thinks is the correct film site], Steven but will soon. The BFRO site is BS--just look at how steep the canyon walls are there, its way too steep.

BIGFOOT BOOKS: Sean, perhaps you'd like to go up there sometime? I'd just like to get your perspective on the site. I'm planning at least two Bluff trips this summer, with other BF people you would surely get along with (unaffiliated, I mean). 
It's not just BFRO that says it's upstream, but also Mr. Perez, on the word of Dahinden. And Barackman, now non-BFRO. Pretty darn convincing, no?
The associate I'm going up there with first, in fact, fairly firmly suspects that the site is downstream, as you do. So, that would be a very interesting and productive trip.

SEAN FRIES: Sure, I would be willing to go up there with you.
[Ed.--That trip hasn't happened yet. It would be nice, though, to truly verify the site and come to a collective agreement as a research community before any "official" plaque is installed.]
*********************************
TALKING WITH CLIFF BARACKMAN
Cliff Barackman presenting at the 2010 Oregon Sasquatch
Symposium. Photo by Steven Streufert
Last summer, 2009, we sought to clarify the location of the site and exact trackway, as we'd been going up there for a couple of years without any absolute certainty. In the course of this inquiry we talked with many researchers. Perhaps most helpful was CLIFF BARACKMAN, out of Portland, OR. Cliff provided this witty little synopsis for us by way of a professional biography:

"I'm entering my 17th year of field work. I've bigfooted in more than a dozen states and provinces.  I've recorded this and that.  I'm trying really hard to film one.  I have a website and blog.  I've been a guest speaker here and there.  I've done some media appearances.  You know, that sort of stuff." 
Enough said, perhaps; but we consider him one of the very best field researchers in the world. He loves to be outdoors and so, he says, he does it for the FUN. A good attitude to have when looking for the Bigfoot in a haystack. Here is the exchange we had with him, along with the mark he made on the topo map we sent him.

BIGFOOT BOOKS: Howdy Cliff (and Daniel), 
I'm working on a little project trying to compare the exact locations various BFers claim as the actual PGF site. I figured I'd ask you two first. Personally, I feel I've been on the very spot Patty stood, but I find it a bit disturbing that I can't prove it.

I've looked around on BFF, for instance, and found that people believe all kinds of weird locations are the spot. When GPS coordinates are given they are nearly always different. Perhaps, if you have a photo editing software program, could you mark an "X" or draw a trackway on the most precise spot you think is accurate? It took me about two minutes in Photoshop to do my own version.

Also, if you know the locations of these I'd really be happy to know:
    * Jerry Crew's footprint find, the famous one
    * John Green and Dahinden's Bluff Creek sandbar prints
    * Onion Mountain and BCM trackways
    * MK Davis' supposed "downstream" film site location

I want to see a map of the entire Bluff Creek watershed with accurate BF sites located. This, when done, would be available freely to all in the BF community, and I think would clear up a lot of silly controversies.
Thanks so much, whatever you can do!
Best, Steve, Bigfoot Books

CLIFF BARACKMAN: Hey there.
 The pic with Wally, Derek, and I was taken at about the middle of the east/west section right before the "bowling alley" turn.  It is facing north.  The pic of the thick stuff was somewhere in the middle of the path of Patty. Good to hear from you.  Cliff

Yours Truly and Cliff, after a couple of beers, after the OSS.
Photo taken by "C.I."
[Ed.--to view Cliff's North American Bigfoot Blog entries on his trips to the PGF site and Bluff Creek use these links:

BIGFOOT BOOKS: [Speaking of our previous blog on the National Geographic filming crew landing on the PGF site area] Well, the helicopter had landed just past the log-jam area at the big bend just upstream from the bat box area and the alder forest next to it. On the gravel there they had markers for the GPS localities they thought were the film site. One by the helicopter on the north bank, and then another upstream a few hundred yards up, before getting to the spot you're describing. They thought that where THEY were was the actual film site. But where you guys are is a bit upstream from there, right? In your opinion or based on your information, where did Patty START walking? Does she finish walking right before the "alley" spot? 

Up across the creek from where you guys are in the picture is a fairly high bank (going north), as I recall, with some fairly thick foresty stuff in there on what feels like old river bar ground, high sand and gravel content up there. If I am correct about your location I walked around up in there last year, and got a very good "read" of the location as pretty similar to what one can recall in there of the film.

Downstream the forest is mostly alders, but up where you are, up on the raised area from the creek, there were more firs, I found. I guess the downstream part could be the very start of the film, up where you guys are in the pictures the end. But what if it all took place back away from where the creek bed is now? I got that feeling when I was up in there. In the film Patty is really pretty close to the canyon wall to the north.

And why is this even controversial? It's strange. The ground itself has moved, and the trees in the film are apparently all gone or so changed as to be unrecognizable.
Keep up the good work, on the hunt and on your blog & web site!
Best, Steve

CLIFF BARACKMAN: Hey there. We were upstream from the spot the helicopter landed.  I believe, though I could be wrong, that the spot the helicopter landed is thought to be the filmsite by Chris Murphy and a few others.  My info comes second-hand from Dahinden through Perez.  Dan showed me the map that Rene drew on pinpointing the location.  This was seconded by Bob Gimlin when he went there with Bobo.

Others, such as Byrne and MK Davis have gone to the site in recent years and thought the location was downstream from the bat boxes, but this is based on what the creekbed looks like today, not then.  As you noted, it has changed dramatically. Thanks on the kudos for my blog.  It's fun.  I like yours too. Cliff

Ed. -- and in a separate reply...

Cliff's mark on the map, just right of the Dahinden bump.
CLIFF BARACKMAN: Hi Steve, Good to hear from you. I'll help you however I can, of course.  John Green might be of more help on most of the spots you'd like to pinpoint.  I'm pretty sure I can show your the PG site and give you an indication where MK Davis' erroneous location is.
I sent back one of the maps you sent along.  I added the red dot where I believe the PG site is.

Though I've been there and could tell you if we were walking there, it's hard to pinpoint MK's spot on that other map you sent because I don't remember the creek splitting like it shows.  It's right about that spot, though. If I remember correctly, MK went there with Don Young, D-man [name edited for privacy], and Sean Fries. You probably know Sean since he lives in Weaverville [Ed.: excision].  He's gotta stop by your shop every once in a while. [Ed.: He does, indeed.]

I know this wasn't much help, but at least it's something.  Let me know if I can be of any more help to you.
Take care, Cliff.
*********************************
THE DANIEL PEREZ INFORMATION
Daniel Perez speaking at the 2007 PGF 40th Anniversary
Celebration, Willow Creek. Photo by Steven Streufert.
We have talked quite extensively with Mr. DANIEL PEREZ about this. He is definitely our favorite journalistic historian of Bigfoot/Sasquatch. Read our interview with him, linked on the upper left side of this blog. We have to say, his work is absolutely fundamental. He's been into the subject since the age of 10, and began studying it seriously when still in his teens. While we were sending off for autographs to baseball players, Perez was corresponding with all the big-name Bigfoot researchers. Hence, he bridges the gap between the early 1960s and 1970s research and the current day, via his contact and friendship with Rene Dahinden among many others.

His booklet, BIGFOOTIMES: BIGFOOT AT BLUFF CREEK is absolutely indispensible. Everyone must have it (and we have them for sale at Bigfoot Books!). We first found the general site area based upon his booklet (with some help from Bobo and Tom Yamarone), bearing the mark on the map that Rene made. Hence, the general location was without doubt preserved, thanks to the perspicacity and tenacity of Perez. Still, when first standing with Scott McClean on the very spot where it was supposed to have happened, we both still felt rather lost. We just could not see anything at all familiar in that first glance, save that it was a wild place with a winding creek in a big mountain canyon.

The location in what we are calling the General Consensus Area (see map above) ranges up and downstream a bit when we try to locate the actual track-way taken by the creature in the film. In the images below one may see that the location varies a little in presentation; and then, there are the accounts that emerged from the 2003 International Bigfoot Symposium trip up there, stating that Perez was downstream farther than the mark, indicating that the site was there rather than up at the exact marked point. Many there agreed, others disagreed. Some such as Al Hodgson felt the location was not at all correct; others felt it was off just because no familiar landmarks were readily apparent. Some simply thought it was a touch up or downstream from where the Symposium group had gathered. Later, Bob Gimlin himself, when up there with James Bobo Fay, put his seal of approval on the upper sandbar location.
PGF BIBLE, no doubt.

We asked Daniel about this, trying to clarify whether Dahinden meant the "X" or arrow on the map to indicate the beginning, middle, or end of the track-way. We also asked him about the information provided by Peter Byrne, as above. Here's the relevant exchange:

BIGFOOT BOOKS: I'd appreciate your perspective, truly. Also, I really wish we could clarify exactly what Rene meant by the mark: the start the middle or the finish of the film trackway? On the ground these things are very important, whereas on a map it looks good enough for government work.  I do not dispute the general location but rather seek the EXACT trackway path. Thing is, the X of Dahinden has to be more at the end segment, not frame 352.

DANIEL PEREZ: "Never got clarification w/ re to this from Rene. As for Peter, he is old and probably out a bit on his geography of the filmsite. dp"

Hence, though Daniel gets the location of the site correctly, the direction of Dahinden was not absolutely specific about the disposition of the course of the film subject. This is CONFIRMATION THAT DANIEL DID NOT GET THE EXACT LOCATION OF THE TRACK-WAY FROM DAHINDEN. However, they did not have commonly available GPS units in those days, and perhaps Rene felt that the mark was good enough, not knowing that there would be so much overgrowth and change in the area, leaving the location of the trackway ambiguous. Back in the days of Green, Titmus, Rene and the others, all one had to do was go there, and the site would be obvious when seeing the gravel/sand bar and the big tree in back. Now that stuff is obscured or altered. And opinions have in recent times begun to diverge. We hope to clarify all of this, so do keep up with our upcoming posts and the videos.

One last mystery remains for today. The above image is the most recent one from Daniel Perez, which he provided to us when we asked for an exact point at which Dahinden had place his mark. Note, in observing the image below, that the arrows in the two images point to two slightly different places along the creek. What is going on here? Is the site slowly moving downstream?
From Bigfoot at Bluff Creek: the arrow pointing to the UPPER sandbar.
Aerial image from 1973. USGS, as with the map below.
Another map from the Perez booklet, showing magnetic north on the compass.
The site? Also the upper sandbar. CLICK IMAGES TO ENLARGE VIEW.
Here's one more oddity: A Google Earth image found on Bigfoot Encounters, showing the "film site" downstream near the bat boxes landing. Clearly, the site is flowing downstream with the passing years!

And here, view M.K. Davis and crew on their version of the PGF site. We're not sure what the logging cable means, but we've asked MK about it. Yes, that is M.K. behind the video camera...

****************************************************
ANGRY BIGFOOT SPEAKS!

What me say, hu-man? You talk so much, hu-mans, me not want to hear another word! Me go now and grunt and howl. It more honest. It more true. Plus, it bring me Bigfoot mate.

****************************************************
This blog is copyright and all that jazz, save for occasional small elements borrowed for "research" and information or satirical purposes only, 2010, Bigfoot Books and Steven Streufert. Borrowings will be tolerated for non-commercial research purposes without the revenge of Angry Bigfoot, if notification, credit, citation and a kindly web-link are given, preferably after contacting us and saying, Hello, like a normal person would before taking a cup of salt. No serious rip-offs of our material for vulgar commercial gain will be tolerated without major BF stomping action coming down on you, hu-man.

Sunday, November 7, 2010

AN INFORMAL INTERVIEW WITH JIM MCCLARIN, Early PGF Investigator and Bigfooting Icon; FRANCES HODGSON, R.I.P.

BIGFOOT'S BLOG, EARLY NOVEMBER, 2010 EDITION
Jim McClarin and Patty Bigfoot together for comparison.
Image generated by Bigfootproject.org from Green and Patterson's films.
AN INFORMAL INTERVIEW WITH JIM MCCLARIN, Early Bigfooter and Witness to the Patterson-Gimlin Film Site.

In the process of investigating the Patterson-Gimlin Film (PGF) and Bluff Creek history during our recent BLUFF CREEK FILM PROJECT (see future blog entries), we asked questions of many of the researchers in Bigfooting who had been there back in the early days. Some of these are our neighbors, like Al Hodgson and Jay Rowland. Others have been John Green, Peter Byrne, Daniel Perez, Larry Lund, Bill Miller, etc.. We also talked with current researchers such as Sean Fries, Cliff Barackman, James "Bobo" Fay, Tom Yamarone and many more. Some of these conversations will be presented in future blogs. Another whom we found contact with, via Facebook of all places, was Jim McClarin. We never expected to be able to get any word from him, as we'd heard he had permanently retired and distanced himself from Bigfooting since the 1970s. Luckily, this wasn't true, altogether; though the end-result interview is a little fragmentary due to his distance from the subject and those days long ago. We'll present the whole thing here as it is, hoping that any stray fragment of information just may come in handy for someone, as much of this did for us in our project. Many of our questions are strictly for Bigfoot nerds; but we're hoping you are as much of one as we are!

Statue guarding the Willow Creek Visitor
Center, carved by Jim McClarin in the late 60s.
Photo by Steven Streufert, 2008.
Who is Jim McClarin, you ask? Jim was a student here locally at Humboldt State University, back then in the mid-late 1960s. During that time he developed an interest in Bigfoot as he heard the stories from around here. He was among the few first viewers of the PGF in Yakima, WA, on October 22nd, 1967, having traveled up there with Rene Dahinden from Willow Creek. Soon after he was back down here and became one of the first, after such as Bob Titmus and Lyle Laverty, to visit the PGF site itself. He returned in summer, 1968, and was filmed by John Green in replication of the creature's walk. Jim published a newsletter for a while, now exceedingly rare, called MANIMALS, from 1972-1973 (see Daniel Perez' offering of them through the link above, with images HERE). He has since retired from Bigfooting, but was gracious enough to try to recall things from the foggy ruins of time and pick his memory for us in the discussion that follows. Some questions were somewhat inconclusively answered, but others brought forth details we had never heard before. Some of these details were greatly helpful to us as we tried to trace the remnants of the old dirt road that followed the creekside of Bluff Creek, and in earlier days allowed access not only for logging, but also for Roger and Bob when they were in Bluff Creek investigating before the captured "Patty" on film. Some questions, the reader will notice, were not answered. Jim had typed up a lengthy answer, but then dozed off at his laptop, and woke to find that movement while sleeping had deleted his reply--like so much in the history of Bigfooting, this information is apparently lost (like the second reel shot by Patterson on October 20th, 1967), at least for now. So far as we know he was last in the Willow Creek area in 2003, while attending as an honored guest as part of the "Pioneer Panel" at the Willow Creek International Bigfoot Symposium.
Jim McClarin depicted in John Green's replication of the PGF, on the
actual, known film site, 1968.
From SQUATCHOPEDIA:
"Jim McClarin began his bigfoot investigations in 1963 and served as a member of early expeditions from northern California to Alaska. McClarin is famous for carving the first bigfoot statue (located at the corner of Hwy's 96 & 299 at Willow Creek). He corresponded with Ivan T. Sanderson, Roger Patterson, John Green, and Rene Dahinden. He recounted some of his memories in 2003 as part of a panel discussion during the International Bigfoot Symposium held in Willow Creek, CA. For McClarin, the "fluidity of movement of the muscles, as well as the light reflecting off the hair" convinced him of the authenticity of the P/G footage. He and two others went to Bluff Creek to view the film site shortly after the film was shot and he was able to see tracks (in poor condition). A comparison movie of McClarin was shot walking along the trackway of "Patty."
2003 Willow Creek International Bigfoot Symposium. Jim McClarin is at
center, with reddish hair, next to Jeff Meldrum and John Bindernagel.
Photo by Steven Streufert. Also present: Henner Fahrenbach Kathy
Moskowitz, Rick Noll, Ed Patrick, John Green, Bob Gimlin, Alton Higgins,
Tom Steenburg, Al Hodgson and Dimitri Bayanov. 
Here is a good account of the WCK-BF-Symp., written by Paul Vella with help from Jerry Riedel
(even though they get some of the details about the PGF site location grievously wrongly):
BIGFOOT INFORMATION PROJECT: International Bigfoot Symposium
************************************************
INTERVIEW

BIGFOOT BOOKS: Steven Streufert September 12 at 4:53pm
(...whose icon is a chupacabras from hereon, as what follows is copied from our Facebook pages, and we just happened to be using that at the time--that is, however, not what we really look like.)

Hello Jim, John Green recommended I contact you. I run a used book shop in Willow Creek, and have been studying the history of Bluff Creek and Bigfoot.

I'm wondering if you could help us out with any indications as the the exact and proper location of the PGF site. Here's the questions I asked John Green and Peter Byrne. Perhaps you could fill in some of the blanks? I've been asking Todd Neiss about this, too, as he was there in the earlier 2000s with Byrne. I'm not sure when you were last on the site. I have topo maps I could send if you'd like.
*******
A few associates and I (BFRO guys, mostly) are going back yet again this coming weekend to Bluff Creek, our goal being to record and document a trip from Louse Camp to where we all think the PG film was filmed.

PGF Site topo map.
Could you tell me:
* when you were last there did you feel certain that you were on the right spot?
* if so, what signs did you see that would confirm it?
* was it upstream from the flat at the bat boxes? Or downstream, as MK Davis thinks it is?
* how far up? At the big gulch with the logjam and rootballs, or perhaps a bit farther? If down, how far?
* did you find the "big tree"?
* how far from the current creek position is it, and how much is left of it in a level state as seen in the old days?
* If I send you a close-up topo map could you put your X on it?

I've already asked this question of Perez, Barackman, and a traveling companion of MK, as well as many of the California BFRO guys. Al Hodgson feels that the site visited in 2003 is incorrect.

I feel that your perspective on these matters would be invaluable, especially as a new generation is moving in, and there are some wildly divergent opinions.
********
Your reply before Friday would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

Best regards, Steve
Bigfoot Books, Willow Creek
  Jim McClarin September 19 at 9:49am
Hi Steve,  My apologies. I thought I had responded but apparently I hadn't. You can send whatever you like although I'm not sure a topo map will enable me to pinpoint the film site. I certainly recall it being in a broad area of the creek bed, allegedly produced by a mudslide some years earlier, hence the dead trees.   Jim
  Steven Streufert September 19 at 3:03pm


Hello Jim, We're just back from the film site area. We are pretty darn sure that we have found the big trees in the back, and the site. However, it is really difficult to compare it in its overgrown state today to the way it was after the 1964 flood, as seen in the PGF from 1967.

I found Peter Byrne's location of the site to be utterly wrong. John Green couldn't really recall how to get to the site, and couldn't see the big tree from where they went in 2003. However, going by Rene Dahinden's mark on the map as seen in BIGFOOT AT BLUFF CREEK, we know (if that is reliable) the real location of the site. That spot is where we found the nice big trees in the back. However, there is still much disagreement on where the site is located. There is, to my observation being there many times, no way to make an exact match with the old photos. Too much has changed.

Here is one of my maps, as posted on Facebook:
PGF SITE MAP, TOPOGRAPHICAL
If you click "previous" or "next" on that screen you should see the next map, too. If you recall, it would be helpful to have your opinion as to the location. I am trying to contact all who were there at the earlier dates to see what they can say.

Thanks! I hope all is well with you.
http://bigfootbooksblog.blogspot.com/
Have you read my blog?

Best, Steve. Bigfoot Books
A close-up view of the PGF Site on Bluff Creek. Can YOU place it? Where?
Share
  Jim McClarin September 19 at 3:59pm
Veni, vidi, sed non vici. I can't even tell you which flat it was in although I suspect the long one. I don't think I ever bothered to try to pinpoint it on a map before. If I had, I could probably do so again.
   Jim McClarin September 19 at 4:02pm
And no, I haven't read your blog. I rarely visit BF sites, maybe one per year or so. I don't mind being available for questions about my experience but I have not tried to follow the subject.
  Steven Streufert September 19 at 5:37pm
You did not conquer? Ah well. Mainly we are interested in any landmarks folks who were there might still recall, and the way they got to the film site. Did you walk up the creek, or access it from a road? Stuff like that. Also, just about ANY recollections of the time and your visits to the site or involvement with the film could help to fill in some gap in the history... and there are a LOT of such gaps. 
McClarin's statue, posing
with Rene Dahinden
Thanks for being around. Involved or not currently, you're a big part of Bigfoot history; and, living in Willow Creek, I really enjoy having your statue around. After all these years it is holding up really well, though there is some dry rot in the feet. Folks are always climbing around on it, and the birds, unfortunately, tend to do their business on it. It is an icon, for sure. Best, Steve
   Jim McClarin September 19 at 6:06pm
As I recall we were able to drive down to Roger and Bob's camp downstream from the site. When I went there in '67 after returning from BC and the showing of the film to the science gathering, we saw hay leavings where the horses had been kept as well as plenty of droppings and hoofprints along the way up to the film site. I think the film site may have been between 1/4 and 1/2 mile upstream from the camp. Coulda been further. I'm not certain but, since we went in a jeep, we may have 4-wheeled it in to the site. Tere was no mistaking the site since the prints were still quite visible, it matched the scenery from the film, and plaster bits remained from Bob Titmus casting a series of the tracks.
  Steven Streufert September 19 at 7:44pm
That's puzzling. There is a camp site right down from the film site, about a quarter of a mile, but Roger and Bob are supposed to have camped 2 or 2.5 miles downstream, according to various accounts. Barbara Wasson said the camp was a little ways north of the bridge over Bluff Creek, down near Louse Camp. Just yesterday we went there and found the only spot around where someone could camp, so we thought perhaps we'd found it. The problem is, all the books say so many different things. We're pretty sure of the site of the film, but it seems the controversy will never go away.
Wasn't there a dirt "road" all the way up the creek? It seems to me much of it would have to have gone right through the creek, or ford across it constantly as it winds back and forth against it's banks.
I'm sitting right next to your statue as I eat at the Mexican restaurant. Someone 1s taking pictures of it right now.

Steve
  Jim McClarin September 20 at 6:29am
OK, it's possible that they were not camped where I thought they had been camped. But where we saw hay leavings and piles of horse dung at the point where a dirt road led down to the creek bed was nowhere near 2 - 2.5 miles downstream of the film site. As I recall we drove right to the apparent camp site without any false leads so I must have had explicit directions from Roger or perhaps from Al Hodgson who Roger had talked to following their exit from Bluff Creek. I'm not sure if this was before or after their drive to the McKinleyville airport to ship the film back to Washington.
  Jim McClarin September 20 at 6:36am
I'm confused at this point as to whether they said they shipped the film to Roger's brother-in-law Al DeAtley or directly to wherever it was processed. 

BTW, I had been to Louse Camp, talking to some bear hunters there on my first visit to Bluff Creek in the summer of 1966. It was down much closer to the mouth of Bluff Creek as I recall and not in the actual creek bed. The "camp" I saw was down in the creek bed and would have been flooded if there were torrential rains, perhaps one reason Roger and Bob were in a hurry to leave. Their stated reason as I recall was that they were worried about the road surface becoming impassible.
  Jim McClarin September 20 at 6:39am
To avoid possible confusion, I meant I'm not sure whether they told Hodgson before or after their trip to the airport.
  Jim McClarin September 20 at 6:55am
Re a dirt road up the creek, yes there was a gravel road (natural creek bed gravel) that crossed the creek at or close to the apparent camp site, then extended all the way up to and past the film site along the eastern side of the creek. I recall a road angled up the east slope off this creek bed road but I don't recall whether it was drivable or just a cat trail. I think it met a roadway higher up on the east side that could be seen in spots from the creek bed but I didn't go up there. I think Roger and Bob said they rode their horses up there to try to intersect "Patty's" trail after she departed the creek bed uphill in that direction but were unable to spot anything.
  Steven Streufert September 20 at 7:19am
Jim, this is fascinating stuff. I'm wondering, would you mind if we continue this discussion and call it an interview for publication on my blog? No one's memory of things that long ago is perfect, and that is why every perspective counts so much. Only so much was ever documented at the time, especially as everyone was seemingly mostly concerned with the creature itself, and not so much with all the other bits of the history of the Bluff Creek events and the locality in general, as well as the timeline of events. Now, so long after, all of these other issues rise to prominence, and many debunkers seek to use apparent contradictions in efforts to discredit the film or impugn the characters of Roger and Bob. I'd love to set the record straight to the greatest degree possible.  Let me know, Steve
  Steven Streufert September 20 at 7:47am
So, regarding the camp site: it was right near by the film site? There are other accounts of a horse camp in that spot, which by your description is right where the current road leads down from the ridge road above to an area with a fire ring and a parking area. From there one proceeds upstream just a short ways up the creek or through the woods to the sandbar where the film was shot. We are talking football field distances from there, not miles. In all his various accountings, Gimlin talks of them riding out from their camp and heading upstream about 2.5 miles to where they saw and filmed the creature. There are accounts in distinction to this, speaking of the horse camp, and even of a primitive corral structure, just down from the film site. Louse Camp is approximately 3 miles down, and is as you describe it, up from the creek bank. The possible Patterson-Gimlin campsite we found was just past the bridge over Bluff, at an area where there appeared to be an old creek ford, as described to us by Al Hodgson in a lengthy interview we did with him earlier this year (you should read it--links are on the upper right side of my blog).
Al seems to think the film site is farther downstream from where most believe it is today. He was there, and got there by hiking up the creek. I am wondering, when you went there, where did you put in with the jeep to head upstream, and how far did you then drive? Also, this is the trip right soon after the film was shot, right? I mean, you went there again the following summer with John Green, and that later trip was when you were filmed walking in the trackway, right? I wonder, with whom did you go up there on that first trip?

Steve
  Steven Streufert September 20 at 8:05am


Re mailing the film: most now believe they took it to Murray Field, outside of Eureka. It was then received by DeAtley and apparently taken to a private processor they knew, as no official Kodak shops were open on Saturdays. Do you know more about any of this? These timeline issues are commonly raised by debunkers who assume it must mean that the story and therefore the film could not be true.
Gimlin says they went directly to Willow Creek and saw Al, then down to the coast to send the film. However, Al still claims that they had gone over the Bald Hills Road to Eureka, mailed it at the main post office, and then come back to Willow Creek to tell Al. The problem is that Al's account could not have been accomplished in the given time, and the post offices would have been closed besides. Any perspectives on all of this? Also, when and how did you meet Rene Dahinden, before heading up to Yakima to view the film, and how did you guys get there?
   Jim McClarin September 20 at 7:56pm
If I had taken the film, I don't think I would have sent it off on an airplane unless I was deep in a wilderness someplace. Even then, I'd probably have insisted on flying out with the film. Why it was deemed so important to get it to DeAtley I can't quite fathom. What would an extra day or two hurt? At any rate, all I know is that I remember they had reportedly sent it by plane. I didn't get the story from Roger but from someone else.
I met Dahinden at Hodgson's variety store. I think he was there by the time I made it over there. Hodgson had come over earlier that morning to the Bigfoot Motel where I had spent the night and informed me of Roger's story. I got dressed and headed over to the store. That may have been my first meeting with Dahinden although I was quite aware of his work in the field. We decided to get up to Yakima as fast as possible so we could see the film. We caught a plane from McKinleyville to Portland, then from Portland to Yakima where we were among the first seven people to view the film.
  Jim McClarin September 20 at 8:28pm

Yes, you may use anything I have written here.
The apparent camp with hay leavings, etc. that I saw was less than a mile downstream from the film site, possibly as little as 100 yards as you suggest. As I recall the road down to the creek at that spot crossed the stream at or very near that little camp and continued up along the right side (east side) of the stream to and past the film site.

It was possibly only a week after the reported filming date that I first went to the site with two other guys in a jeep belonging to one of them. Daniel Perez has the name of the Jeep owner. I can't recall it just now. We forded the very shallow stream at an obvious fording place following the dirt/gravel road. It was not a far drive at all, a few hundred yards, maybe as little as 100 yards.
Multi-frame PGF overlay, as caught in a screen capture from MonsterQuest.
I had a super-8 movie with me and used it to film the footprints, then had one of the other guys film me as I walked along the trail of tracks. I had him film from where I thought Patterson must have been. I sent that film to John Green although he doesn't recall receiving or viewing it. I think he did see it, however, and determined it wasn't useful for size comparison since I was way off on the camera location. I think that's what gave him the idea to try for another film using slides from the PG film to determine where Patterson had to be holding his camera.

I may never have gotten the film I made returned from Green, but if I did, it appears to have been lost, either by me or by Loren Coleman, to whom I gave most all my BF stuff when I got out of the business. Loren has checked without luck and figures if I ever gave it to him, it was lost in one of his many moves around the country.

The Green film with me as subject was indeed shot the following summer.
  Steven Streufert September 25 at 12:45pm


Sorry for the delayed reply. This has been a crazy week. Read the cover story article about me that came out at northcoastjournal.com to see part of what has been going on for me.

Historic image of the Jim McClarin
Oh-Mah Bigfoot, still with its original
base, the tree from which it was carved.
The "road" up Bluff, then, was more of a winding 4WD trail, or old logging route, right?

So, it sounds very clear from your description that you were in the same area we were, what is now called the "bat boxes" landing. Were you there in 2003, after the Willow Creek Symposium? If so, what were your impressions of the site then, the changes to it, and the reactions of all of the people there? Could you even tell where the site was?

When you were there in '67 and '68 did you see tracks beyond the main ten that Titmus cast? Where did they head in either direction?

To disprove this so-called "Bluff Creek Massacre" theory, can you say if you saw any sign of bloody pools or prints, Bigfoot remains, signs of a tractor on site, or any other unusual thing like bullet shells? MK Davis says that Green, Gimlin and the others killed a family of BF and filmed it. Crazy, eh?

When you first saw the film, did you view the entirety of both reels? What was on them, as much, and sequentially, as you can recall....?

If we are doing a little interview here I should ask, how did you get involved in Bigfooting, and what were your first impressions and interactions with people like Green and Dahinden, pioneers in the field?

Thanks! Steve
  Steven Streufert September 25 at 1:15pm


DANIEL PEREZ' EMAIL:
"I would ask Jim, when he met Rene in Willow Creek, did it ever dawn on them or him that maybe they should visit the filmsite first, then go see the film?

Jim McClarin's Oh-Mah statue as it is
today. Photo courtesy of Bob Doran.
The name of the guy who first took Jim to the filmsite was Richard Henry. Think that was around November 5th. As for the base camp, I don't think anyone now can say with any certainty. If that is what Barbara states, that may be so, as she had access to Bob Gimlin.
I think that about does it.

I would just review with Jim some of the things he was feeling at the time. I think at one time he stated it would not be long before they would get one, but that was in 1967?
Did he ever felt he was being watched while at the filmsite?
What was his impression of George Haas?
What was him impression of the 2003 Willow Creek gathering?
What was his impression of seeing his statute there in Willow Creek?"

BIGFOOT BOOKS: Some good questions, and info on the Jeep fellow.

Best, Steve
  Steven Streufert September 28 at 11:10am


Hi Jim... Did you get my last two messages?
We are heading up to Bluff Creek again on Oct. 8th for yet more documentation. It would be great to have as much information from your experience as possible to take with us up there. So far your statements about the jeep trip up there have been VERY helpful. We are going to try to document the remnant signs of the old creekbed "road."

Thanks! Steve
 Jim McClarin September 28 at 5:09pm Report

Ha. I got your messages, got most of one answered, fell asleep at the computer (I have a laptop table I use in bed), and somehow erased it. At any rate it wasn't there when I woke up :-) I will respond in time.
  Steven Streufert September 28 at 5:37pm
  Thanks!
  Steven Streufert October 11 at 1:08pm
Jim, Just back from Bluff Creek! Your recollections proved to be very helpful. We traced the old Jeep road up the creek, finding remaining signs of it there even today. We also think we have located the P-G base camp site and the proper film site/trackway location.
Well, we ruled out the MK Davis, Peter Byrne and Christopher Murphy film site locations, and clarified where it really is, I truly believe, all based on one "aerial" photo Rene D fortunately thought to take in 1972, that the case is now in the bag. I think Cliff Barackman's location is just slightly off. We climbed down the hill from above and I think very clearly found from that angle the properly rounded front of the sandbar, conforming perfectly to Dahinden's photo. Tall trees in back led us further. Moving back we found a cluster of big trees and an old stump buried by a big fern that match the film and known measurements pretty darn well exactly. The images will have to be manipulated in Photoshop to get the right comparative perspective (impossible now due to vegetation growth) to the old film site photos. The "big tree" seems still to be there. One large fir in that area seems to have fallen onto the sandbar. It has an alder growing out of its top, so now we need a tree ring sample to know its age. I feel no lingering doubt that we now know the exact location. Now all we need to do is measure the trackway in there for exactitude.

A full report and YouTube videos will follow on my blog.

Best regards,
Steve, Bigfoot Books
  Jim McClarin October 12 at 5:50am Report
Glad to hear it, Steve. I've been getting a little exposure to BF in reading Lloyd Pye's "Everything You Know is Wrong." Interesting insights but I don't follow some of his logic sequence.
  Steven Streufert October 12 at 11:41am



Pye's book stuck me as odd and fascinating, though I have not read it---it's hard to find a copy!

We're still trying to put all the Bluff Creek puzzle pieces together, so any further recollections from you would be truly helpful and interesting.

Don't feel obliged to answer all of those questions from Daniel Perez--I only sent those for your interest.

Do you know how far past the film site the old jeep/logging road went?

Did you see any tracks farther down from the film trackway?

Things like that have still not been resolved.

Best, Steve
  Jim McClarin October 12 at 5:39pm Report


I don't know how far upstream the jeep road went and I saw no tracks beyond the stretch shown in the PG film. They disappeared once they left the sand and got onto the gravel.

I'm partial to Pye's thesis that Homo sapiens diverges in so many ways from "early man" and appeared so suddenly that we are the likely result of somebody's genetic tampering experiment. I just finished Sitchin's "The Twelfth Planet" (the Sumerian version of Genesis), which I think Pye will get into in his "Everything..." book. I'm reading it straight through without skipping around so I could be wrong. The Sumerians, according to Sitchin, claim that their "gods" created the Adamu in their own likeness as a servant species, although there were plenty of failed attempts leading up to that point. Sitchin figures they combined their own genes with Earth's hominids

If you want a copy, here's Lloyd's advice:
Be sure to get it at www.iuniverse.com. Best prices there, and new copies. Amazon will screw you over with used ones.

iUniverse enables writers to become published authors. With leadership that brings expertise in publishing, sales, marketing and technology, iUniverse offers industry-leading self-publishing products and services. By offering a variety of affordable self-publishing, editorial and marketing services,...
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  Steven Streufert October 27 at 5:05pm
  Hi again, Jim.

Thanks for the tip on the Pye book... I will have to read that one soone. By the way, did you hear Sitchin just passed away a while back?

I was wondering, did you ever get around to answering some of those questions I'd asked previously? I mean the ones you had answered, but then lost on your computer by accidental deletion? (See above on the Facebook page, probably in "earlier messages," if you don't have them stored away in your email.) I'm going to post the relevant stuff from our preceding conversation in a blog entry about the PGF site soon. I was hoping to reach a point of completion with that. Anything you can do, or have time and inclination for, would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Steve, Bigfoot Books
  Jim McClarin November 5 at 5:00pm
Hi Steven, Here's something I wrote in response to someone else that might contain mtl. of interest to you:
I don't recall the date of my trip with John to the film site but it seems likely John would have indicated that in his following book. The hour would have been late morning to early afternoon due to the fact we were in a canyon and would have been shaded otherwise. I don't know if John was trying to approximate the hour the PG film was taken in his film of me but the lighting dynamics meant we would not have been more than a few hours off. I haven't compared shadows in the two films and made no record of time or date that I recall.

John wanted to use me as the model in his film for two reasons: I'm fairly tall, plus I had visited the site in the week or so following Patterson's filming and knew where the tracks had been. I visited after Bob Titmus had gone to the site and made his series of plaster casts of the best prints. By next summer there were still some nondescript, weathered depressions with small bits of plaster as I recall remaining from the track sequence. Obviously no flooding had occurred over the winter. I walked along these depressions and continued where I recalled the track heading. The impressions had stopped where the sand gave way to gravel/rock, meaning that the trackway was not very long.

Lyle Laverty's PGF site track photo.
In retrospect it would have been good to make detailed notes of how many footprints were visible (I'm thinking 12 to 18), take measurements of each stride and measurements to various surface features (logs, etc.) but it just never occurred to me at the time. What did occur to me was to film the tracks with a super-8 movie camera, then have one of the guys I was with film me walking along next to the footprints. Unfortunately that film was taken from nowhere near the same angle or with the same lens so it was useless for comparison. I seem to recall Green pronouncing it worthless so, while my memory of it is very indistinct, it seems I must have sent the film to him. I think that's what gave him the idea of doing another shoot with a camera like Roger used and using frames from Patterson's film to determine through triangulation just where his camera was during the original filming. Green does not recall my film at all and if I indeed sent it to him he might have returned it to me and I lost it. When I got out of the BF "business" I gave almost all my files, casts, and other research materials to Loren Coleman but he doesn't recall my original filmstrip either and says if he ever had it, it was probably lost in any one of a dozen moves since then.

When I first viewed the site in '67 I estimated my own prints sank 1/4 inch while the adjacent BF prints sank an inch but the comparison was not especially valid since the sand was probably wetter on my visit, which no doubt affected the compaction.
  Steven Streufert November 7 at 4:21pm
OK, Jim, thanks so much! If you have any further things to say or memories in regard to the PGF do please send them along. This has been more helpful than you know, especially in thinking about the old creek road leading up to the film site. I'll send you links to our research, in blog format and via YouTube videos, when they are ready and posted.      Best Regards! Steve, Bigfoot Books, Willow Creek
The carved wooden information sign accompanying Jim McClarin's Bigfoot
statue in Willow Creek. Photo by Steven Streufert, 2008. CLICK TO ENLARGE
END OF INTERVIEW


Be sure to read LOREN COLEMAN'S COMMENT for an update, by this link, or click below.
****************************************************
Al and Frances Hodgson, Willow Creek, CA, 2007. The PGF 40th
Anniversary Celebration. Photo by Steven Streufert.
SAD NEWS: We offer our condolences to our friend, and grand friend of Bigfoot, AL HODGSON, in regard to the passing of his beloved wife, FRANCES HODGSON (1929-2010). Al had spent the last few years largely caring for her. She had Alzheimer's. Al was gracious enough to give us at Bigfoot's bLog a full three hours of his time back in February for an interview. Frances was present the whole time, in the living room. She was a great lady, whom we met at the 2007 Patterson-Gimlin Film 40th Anniversary Celebration, here in Willow Creek. During Al's many visits to our shop, Frances would normally sit out in the truck outside, but would always wave kindly upon departure. Any respects and condolence messages any of you would like to have passed on to Al by us will be forwarded to him. Send to bigfootbooks@gmail.com
PGF 40th Celebration--Al and Frances can be seen, partially obscured,
in the far right corner, back row. Daniel Perez is front near right;
organizer Tom Yamarone in front, off center left; yours truly at far left.
Really, too many luminaries to count--it was a GREAT time!
As Daniel Perez eulogized her this month in his BIGFOOT TIMES newsletter:
"Passings: Frances Hodgson, the wife of Al Hodgson for 61 years, died on September 25, 2010. Her place in high profile Bigfoot lore is secure, as she was the person who took a call from the late Roger Patterson, when he phoned their home on October 20, 1967, to let them know a 16-mm film of Bigfoot was made in Bluff Creek earlier that day. Frances was involved in the church all her life and was a member of the Willow Creek Bible Church. She was born in Illinois on February 16, 1929."
Al Hodgson with Tom Yamarone at the event, a meeting of generations
in Bigfooting. Photo by Steven Streufert, 2007.
****************************************************
ANGRY BIGFOOT SPEAKS!
Serious hu-man toxic. Me want study salamanders! Too many hoax, way, way too much BS all humanogenic (me learn new word!). Bigfoot one day prove humanity is a hoax. Don't question Bigfoot. Question humanity. Me try be friend with you hu-man. Now me just do not know. Maybe me go back to being scary "cannibal," no more Mr. Nice Bigfoot. Yeah, me do that.
****************************************************
This blog is copyright and all that jazz, save for occasional small elements borrowed for "research" and information or satirical purposes only, 2010, Bigfoot Books and Steven Streufert. Borrowings will be tolerated for non-commercial research purposes without the revenge of Angry Bigfoot, if notification, credit, citation and a kindly web-link are given, preferably after contacting us and saying, Hello, like a normal person would before taking a cup of salt. No serious rip-offs of our material for vulgar commercial gain will be tolerated without major BF stomping action coming down on you, hu-man.